David Sinclair on the Longevity Pill, Age Reversal Timelines, and Updated Protocols | EP #249 — Transcript

This feels like another Wright brothers moment. Once you can fly, everything changes. And I think we’re about to learn whether we can fly or not. I’m pretty sure we can. >> The use dour, you are days away from the first human epigenetic reprogramming trial. >> Three of the Yamanaka genes, a subset of them. They’re going into uh the eye of a patient shortly to see if we can cure blindness. We find that every tissue that we go into as a field, we see benefits. brain age reversal, improvement in memory, motor neurons, uh so ALS, the immune system, muscle, kidney, mentioned liver, skin. A true longevity therapeutic when given would work throughout the entire body. And and that’s the objective here. Is there an upper limit to how long humans can live? >> I’m not saying that, but I am saying that um >> now that’s a moonshot, ladies and gentlemen. David, please. I grab my hot water and

[00:01:00] lemon. What are you drinking? >> Coffee. >> Coffee. All right. >> I couldn’t find any matcha. >> Well, you know, I mean, coffee actually is good for you. The studies show caffeine is um you know, I probably do about three cups. And and I think it’s also that decaffeinated coffee, it’s all the other molecules in the cocoa in the caffeine bean. Yeah, coffee comes in and out of fashion, but the fashion is definitely in the positive right now for longevity. >> So, it’s it’s not a bad way to start the day. Caffeine’s fine. People ask me, is it okay to drink caffeine? And Serena and I drink tea all the all day pretty much until uh you know, we can’t take any more caffeine, but um it is good. >> And we’re going to talk about your longevity protocols as well. But what I’m excited about is to give everybody an update on our approach towards longevity singularity to add that term together. Uh the moment in time that we really know that we’re extending the healthy human lifespan. Uh let’s begin

[00:02:00] on uh the news. Dour you are days away from the first human epigenetic reprogramming trial. Tell us about that. Uh well, if if you’ve been under a rock, uh let me tell you that uh we’ve worked out uh maybe we could talk a bit about the science behind it, but we have a we have a drug candidate that came out of my lab. Uh it was published first in 2020 on the cover of Nature magazine and the title on the cover was Turning Back Time. And we we reported um and I want to give big credit to my student Wangloo who uh worked for many years to try and find certain genes and combinations that could safely reverse aging but not go so far that you could cause cancer or lose identity of the cell. And he found it. It took a long time and in retrospect it looks easy cuz we now know the answer. But it was tough at the time and he was ready to quit. He’s in my office almost crying. Uh and I said, “You got to try. We I have a good feeling.” And so he he

[00:03:01] found three genes. Three of the Yamanaka genes, a subset of them. These Yamanaka genes um I think you all know are what what we use to make stem cells. But we don’t want to use the technology to make stem cells. If I turned you all into a giant lump of stem cells, that would not be good. Um and mice die within 2 days if you use all of Yamanaka’s genes. So anyway, we have three of the genes. We call them OSK for short. They’re going into uh the eye of a patient shortly to see if we can cure blindness having succeeded really well in mice and monkeys to cure their blindnesses. So, uh life Yeah, I know I know a number of you are investors along with me in life biosciences. So, super excited about that. Uh heading towards reversing blindness. what would be uh in success and fingers crossed uh where would you head next? What which organ systems would you go after after that?

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Yeah. So what’s remarkable about about the technology is we didn’t choose the eye because we thought it would work best. In fact, I was recommending against it because the eye, you know, curing blindness is not something that’s easy. I thought the liver would be a good way to go and that’s probably the next place we go in the human body. uh what other labs and and ours now are showing and and seemingly now every month or so another lab publishes on this technology. So it’s it’s not just my lab. It’s great. It’s being reproduced and expanded now that we find that every tissue that we go into as a field, we see benefits. And so it’s not just the eye, we see benefits. Uh well, I’ll just list my lab’s work. Uh brain age reversal, this is all in mice currently. brain age reversal improvement in memory in old age and Alzheimer’s models motor neurons uh so ALS um which is clearly an incurable disease currently but we think we can help there uh the immune system muscle

[00:05:02] kidney mentioned liver skin the list goes on and and the liver >> joints >> joints joint a new paper came out from a different group just last week that I tweeted about um and so yeah we we all experience some kind of back pain or joint pain in our lives and there’s not much you can do. This technology seems to regrow the joint and the cartilage and even the bone which >> really really important point here. A true longevity therapeutic doesn’t just work in one cell type. It doesn’t just work in hpatocytes. A true longevity therapeutic when given would work throughout the entire body. And and that’s the objective here. >> It definitely is that that’s really our goal. The reason we’re going after one tissue at a time is because it’s untested technology in humans and the FDA just recently allowed Life Biosciences to go into the clinic. But if we’d said we’re going to inject this technology into the whole body, the FDA would have been I think a lot more cautious. So we’re going uh tissue by

[00:06:01] tissue now. But I don’t see a reason why as we learn more and we see more safety that we couldn’t go, you know, in intravenously. um that we need some technologies to be developed. Um right now we’re using viral like particles to target the eye and the liver. Um those are great for targeted but a whole body is either going to require something like the lipid nano particle or even a chemical. >> Let’s talk about that. So the current therapy that you’ve developed and and it’s it’s using um an ADN no associated virus and AEV and these gene therapies uh have traditionally been expensive uh anywhere from like a half a million dollars to $2 million per treatment is at a rough order of magnitude. We want to treat millions of patients. Actually, we’re going after glaucoma. So, it’s I hope it’s not that expensive, but you know, my goal is to bring the price down as fast as possible. >> And and towards that end, uh I’m very excited about the other. So, just to to

[00:07:00] lay it out, right, the current treatments that are going into trials are using these adnoassociated viruses uh which are an expensive mechanism for delivering the OSK. But you and your and your amazing graduate students have actually developed an alternate and and I think it’s your entry into the longevity x prize as well into the healthspan x- prize uh which looks to be you know I don’t call it magical but it’s the potential of it is extraordinary. Could you speak about what you’ve developed? >> Uh sure. So we we developed this current technology that’s going into humans uh shortly. Um in fact patients are being recruited right now so it’s it’s imminent. Um that technology for us in the Sinclair lab is 2017 technology. uh and and actually quite literally I like to point out to to my students that what we published is literally what’s going into humans which

[00:08:02] I’ I’ve said to you separately that’s really rare that your PhD student makes a makes a drug that goes into humans but he did it but yeah give the point since 2017 we’ve been working in my lab on bringing the price down finding new ways and the cheapest is a small molecule small molecule can be made potentially for, you know, a few cents a pill. And uh we find that the the dosing uh even with ER100, which is the viral uh candidate drug going into humans, you only need 6 weeks. So, you know, in 6 weeks, some doctor may even know the answer whether this works in humans cuz it’s going to be fairly obvious if someone can see again or not or see better. These chemicals uh could be very cheap. We’ve been working on them. We’ve been using um mostly artificial intelligence to screen billions of molecules in in in silicone. Um and we’re now at the stage where we’re in the lab using AI and and visual

[00:09:02] visualization machine learning to tell us whether cells from human old humans 92 year olds their skin cells can be reversed back to a 20-year-old. And we know OSK works the gene therapy works and we’re looking for uh molecules that do that. And I can say we already have a proof of concept which is a cocktail of molecules that uh some of which we published on already a couple of years ago and those we hope to put into a clinical trial into humans uh within the next couple of months as part of our next prize uh competition. >> Amazing. And how much might that cost just to give people a sense of the price point? While the adnoassociated virus gene therapies are in the hundreds of thousands to low millions, how much might a a you know three molecule pill that you’re taking cost you for treatments? >> Well, yeah, right now it is a three molecule cocktail. Ultimately, if it reaches the market, um it will be one. I

[00:10:02] I don’t plan on taking three to market. that there’s all sorts of reasons including the FDA makes it very difficult to make cocktails. Um, and they make you test each one and the combinations which is we we we’ll find one. But the the the the three factor molecules, they’re expensive to make. They’re hundreds of thousands of dollars right now to make it in a kilogram scale. Uh, but that doesn’t have to be. Uh, with scale up, it really could be a lot less. I I don’t want to say how much, but you know, it one day I hope that it’ll be like Metformin, which is a you know, it’s it’s pretty cheap. Anyone on the planet could afford it. And that’s >> Yeah. When we were on Moonshots uh pod together, and I encourage you guys to see that episode. It’s an amazing dive that I did with David. Um you know, you predicted, you know, a couple hundred bucks a month as a as a potential range. So, I just it’s really important to understand that this longevity uh revolution we’re about to hit is not just for the ultra wealthy. Uh I mean

[00:11:01] one of the precepts of the Healthspan X-P prize that Dr. Jamie Justice runs is that we are encouraging uh the you know development of therapeutics that are accessible to 8 billion people. Right? we uplift humanity as we as we as we do this. >> Um, and so, you know, I like to say that when technology first comes out and it doesn’t work well, it’s the wealthy who experiment with it. And by the time it works really well, it’s available to 8 billion people. And that’s going to be true here. >> It is. It I I always talk about the Wright brothers cuz this feels like another Wright brothers moment that if it works, maybe even bigger than that. But the the Wright brothers, people said it wouldn’t work. This will never happen. New York Times a few weeks before Wright brothers took off said it’ll be a million years before humans fly. And then they did it and then suddenly everyone said it can be done. But it wasn’t for everybody. It was for the wealthy to fly initially in the early part of the 20th century and even

[00:12:00] up until the the 60s and 70s. But it’ll it’ll it’ll it’ll happen faster than that. uh I can see a future where uh within you know certainly within our lifetime um we’ll we’ll have these these pills available and the important thing is I’m not the only one I may be most advanced in in the work that we’re doing but there are lots of people and lots of money uh behind us um so even if we deviate or things hit a snag which I I don’t expect but that could happen it’s going to happen so that’s the the real point here is 20 years ago go. I didn’t know if it was going to happen in our lifetimes. I was trying to go as fast as possible and trying to get the word out to to raise awareness and bring in really bright students into the field. That mission, it’s still ongoing, but I would say it’s it’s been successful and and now I think the wave is such that it’s going to happen in our lifetime. That that’s something that would be crazy if it didn’t. And it may be sooner

[00:13:00] than we think. It may be 2026 is the year we learn that age reversal is possible in humans. Um, this is part of our singularity, folks. Part of this incredible moment of everything all at once everywhere getting reinvented. Um, uh, and it’s, uh, yeah, speedrunning every speedrunning Star Trek, as I like to say. >> I do want to say something about Peter is, uh, you know, he’s he does a lot of good for the world and and he’s unique in doing that. um one of the things that he’s done among many uh for the field of longevity, the X-P prize with Jamie Justice. Um and if if you’ve donated to that prize, thank you. It’s it’s a wonderful cause and I can tell you that I would not be putting our chemical cocktail that we’ve now tested extensively in animals into people if it if it weren’t for the X-P prize. >> We’re trying to accelerate the future. Yes. Yeah. Thank you, buddy. >> Thank you, Peter. Um a couple of points to uh to pull out. There’s we could spend days on stage together, but uh

[00:14:02] trying to consolidate I think people need to understand as well that the conversation around longevity and the pioneering work that you did early on had a lot of push back. Uh a lot of people there was a negative stigma against doing work in this field and yet you saw the potential and you persisted. uh which is what the great scientists and thinkers do despite what your fellow scientists or you know and so I just want to thank you for that. Um it’s not easy. Uh I I’ve been on the inside. You’re a dear friend and I’ve heard the trials and tribulations and you’ve persisted uh with Serena’s support nonetheless. Um and thank you for that. Um a couple of of key questions here. Um, and I just want to I want to pull these out. Uh, is there an upper limit to how long

[00:15:02] humans can live? You know, is it just 120 we’re aiming for or 130 we’re aiming for? You know, people say, “Okay, well, we might extend health span, you know, those extra few decades, but, you know, we’re going to time out.” What do you think? How do you answer that? Uh well um as I wrote in lifespan uh the book uh there is no law that says we have to age that anyone who says that there is a limit doesn’t know what they’re talking about. It’s doable right we can live hundreds of years that’s already happening in the animal world and you know some people live into their well beyond 100 up to 122 is the maximum. There’s a lot of room um to to go with what we already know is possible. Now, can we go beyond that? Can we go beyond a whale even? Well, I don’t see any reason biologically or phys, you know, looking at physics why

[00:16:01] there is a limit. You know, it it feels weird to say we we can live hundreds of years, maybe thousands of years. Um, and I I don’t know uh yet how we’re going to get there, but what I’ve seen in the last 5 years has blown my mind. The fact that there’s a reboot system in the cells that can not just make a cell healthier, but but literally reset it so it is young, not just behaves young, which is what we did for the first 20 years in the field is young and stays young. It’s reprogrammed literally. the fact that there’s a backup copy and that we now know you can reboot the cells >> over and over again >> over and over. We don’t know how many times because the the mice actually we we did it multiple times in the eye and then the mice died of old age but they had really good eyesight. So we we want to try and do this multiple times in a whole animal and we’re working on that. So I don’t see an upper limit and you know often I’m quoted out of context saying oh we can

[00:17:01] live forever or that kind of thing and I’m not saying that but I am saying that um the mere fact that uh the Wright brothers could fly we could see that one day there would be the Concord jet and going to the moon the same with longevity. Yes. >> Once you can fly, everything changes. And I think we’re about to learn whether we can fly or not. And uh >> I’m pretty sure we can. >> Yeah. And at the speed at which science is going, right? The work that we just saw from Laya, the work we’re going to see from other speakers, the whole field of AI is, you know, the there’s this accelerating future in which the added time brings us all these additional breakthroughs. It gives us added time and the exponent goes greater than one. I I want to go back to that uh moonshot podcast we did uh cuz there are a number of members in the room here who are part of Fossil Fosl. It’s friends of Sinclair Lab. So when I interviewed David

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um God I don’t know it was a year ago. It feels like ages ago. It’s a year ago I think. >> Um at my my Moonshots podcast studio here in Santa Monica. Um David was was glum and I was like what’s going on? and he was like, “Uh, our funding just got cut because of the battle between the White House and Harvard and I have to let all of my graduate students go.” My dean has said, “You got to let them go.” And it’s like, “WTF? What? No. No. No way.” And uh I mean it’s like whenever I mean hopefully this is your judo move. When you see a problem that exists, your answer is no. I’m going to solve it. And so, uh, at that moment, um, uh, we sort of I sort of spun up. I said, “Okay, uh, listen, I’m gonna let’s create something called Friends of Sinclair Lab. Um, I’ll contribute the first 50K, but let’s ask the Moonshot audience to participate.” Uh, and we announced it. Max Song spun up a few QR codes and

[00:19:01] a website instantly. Thank you, Max. uh and uh the outpouring of support was was nothing less than extraordinary. I think you know your budget uh the budget you were getting from the government was how much that got cancelled then? How much per year? >> Uh it was it in the millions. Um all >> million 2 three million >> something like that. Yeah. Including the fellowships that my scientists had brought with them. Their career got cut short too at the time. and we were able over the course of the next few months uh to bring in I think on the order of $6 million of private annual support was amazing. Thank you. Now, now I I just want to hit on this um uh because there’s a perversion in the way we we fund science, which is uh when you write a scientific I’m going to say this for you so that you don’t have to say it uh and get dinged by anybody, but this

[00:20:01] is my understanding and experience of it. If you’re trying to propose something radical for a grant, the people reviewing it don’t want radical science. They want predictable science that they know the answer is going to be there. And you’re writing a grant for something that might take a year or two to get funded. It is it is retrospective. It’s reactive. It’s it’s backwards. And >> and and there’s a 10% chance you get it. >> And the 10% chance you’re going to get it. So what I love is that through the friends of Sinclair lab, some of people have given us 50k uh and I don’t see any of this. All of this goes to his research. So grateful to all of the friends of Sinclair Lab. >> Um some have given up to a million. Um it’s a it’s this this money goes directly to to David and his grad students. Genius like where the highest signal is right now. Let’s do that experiment. Let’s do that experiment. Let’s do that experiment. It unleashes you to do work on the cutting edge. >> It has. We’re actually in better shape

[00:21:00] now thanks to you and and all of the friends than we were a year ago. And we can actually go so fast. It’s it’s blows my mind. And we used to be limited by by these grants. And I was spending half my time writing grants. Literally, it’s a lot for scientists. And the system’s broken clearly. It’s a huge waste of capital. We’ve got PhDs, professors, some of the smartest minds in the country who just are at their computers typing grants all day uh instead of doing the work. Um but yeah, it’s really changed how we do science. Uh we’re going so fast now. An example of that is so we have these uh bionly every second month we have a a zoom call and the friends get together and on the last one uh so my student was presenting her data and she said sorry I couldn’t present last time my kidneys are failing I had diialysis today I need a new kidney and then uh one of the the members >> Brett Blundy who’s a member of our community here he’s one of the benefactors for the health span prize one of our benefactors at the X-P prize

[00:22:00] as So Brett said, “How fast can we cure this?” I said, “Well, >> let let’s let’s do it.” And he goes, “All right, I’ll I’ll fund that project so we can get started within weeks of an idea instead of years, if ever.” >> Yeah. >> It’s amazing. It’s it’s the way science should be done. And what I want to do um now that this model is really proven to work brilliantly is to to teach the best minds in across the world that this is a much better way of doing science. And everybody benefits. The world benefits, the members benefit. I think it’s very exciting for the members because they get to >> they have a personal relationship with you. They’re texting you and they’re visiting the lab and they’re having dinner with you and Serena. >> Yeah. And and they get the same feeling I do as a scientist. They we make discoveries. And how exciting is that to learn before humanity does about how how uh uh the world is going to look in the future. And that’s the best part of being a scientist is learning things that you just didn’t think could even be possible before everyone else.

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It’s uh it it truly is uh extraordinary. So I want to thank all of you who are members of the Friends of Sinclair Lab Fossil and maybe you might even share during the Q&A here your your your thoughts about it. Um I want to spend the last few >> I just want to say about the fossil program. We we have uh about 70 members. >> How many? >> 70. >> 70. Wow. >> So, it’s been wonderful. And >> um but we we are going to limit it because if it gets too large, it’s not a community. Uh but there will be a wait list. Uh but I think today if if you’re interested, please either write to Peter, Max, and and Marissa who is down the front, my chief of staff. >> Marissa, just stand up one second so people can see. >> Um and she’ll give you your her business card and uh you can >> or reach out to a member of my team if you want to be involved in supporting that. >> Yeah. and and it’s not a commitment, but we’ll we’ll tell you more about what what is involved and what the community is like. >> I mean, sort of like throwing yourself a touchdown pass in the longevity game. I I I think of it that way. Uh but I’m not

[00:24:00] a sports guy. Let’s talk about your uh let’s talk about your longevity protocols, David. uh what are you doing right now um to maintain your boyishl like uh uh complexion and physique uh and uh and head you towards longevity escape velocity. >> Uh well, thank you. I’m not sure that I deserve that, but it’s kind um definitely too many too many days on the road with Serena for uh >> Yeah, so you guys are on an airplane all the time. >> Yeah, that’s that’s our downfall. But um it’s it what I wrote about in lifespan is still holds true. So if you haven’t got the book or you do check out page 304 that is the the basis. >> Just speedrun if you would. >> All right. Um All right. But but don’t post this. Uh this is between friends. I mean I I suffer from my face showing up on people’s websites selling products. So this is an issue. >> You’re not promoting any products. Very

[00:25:00] clear. >> Yeah. Okay. Uh just and this is also for my father who is now 86 and in perfect health. So and >> so mom if you’re listening please take notes here. >> Yeah. Um the three the three main ones uh that we’ve been taking for over 15 years. Um you remember the good old story resveratrol in red wine. That’s still a staple for us and we’ve got some really good data that we’re going to submit to nature on that. Um, so that’s mixed with some olive oil or some yogurt or a small amount of uh something oily or proteinatious, a lot of protein, so it dissolves. If you just drink resveratrol or take a pill, it mostly passes straight through you. Um, so that’s a good one. That’s an activator of cert one, which is a longevity enzyme we’ve worked on for many years. And by the way, I haven’t told this publicly, but the Sertuins, if you know about them and you’ve read my book, we’re finding they’re very important for the the reprogramming. So the the early work

[00:26:01] from my career is is all linked into the information theory of aging, which is the basis of our work now. Resverrol uh NMN uh NMN is nicotinomide monucleotide, but it on online it’s called NMN. Don’t confuse that with M&M’s. You will not live longer. And then the third one um is a glucose lowering medicine. So the one of choice, well there are two of choice and I cycle between them. Serena and I do that. Um so Metformin is requires a prescription. That’s a diabetes type two diabetes drug. Uh relatively safe as a medicine. Uh we take a gram a day of that. >> Mhm. >> Um but it can give you a stomach upset. So there’s a natural version of metformin which is known as bourberine which has a lot of clinical data as well that um has benefits as well including lowering of blood glucose and actually your glucose levels are really important. So look at glucose, look at

[00:27:00] pasta, look at carbs uh especially processed carbs. If I could just add on that, one of the things that we found at Fountain Life looking at our our members is the number one thing that correlates with heart disease is not your HDL, your LDL, your LP little A L uh LP little A. The number one thing that correlates with heart disease is your hemoglobin A1C, your glucose levels. Thank you, buddy. Um, yeah. >> Well, good. I mean there there’s a whole symphony we carry carry bags of supplements so it would take a while to go through those of course u but a new one that we’ve added in the last couple of years is nattokynise if you haven’t heard of it it’s it’s an enzyme I’m sure you have as well >> yeah my father’s on that now too it’s >> really the the only thing that’s been very clearly shown in large trials of thousand plus people to reverse plaque in the body it’s also natural enzyme that comes from natto the Japanese uh

[00:28:01] breakfast that smells like vomit. >> Oh my god. >> Some people eat natto. Uh Serena likes natto. I hate it. So, I take the pills. And you need um a fair amount. If you look at the clinical trials, I think it’s at least 8,000 units of that. Know how much? 10,000. Serena’s telling me from the from the crowd. Um so 10,000 units. If you if they I think if they gave them six, it didn’t work. So, and it took a year. So, you need to be consistent. But I’m doing the experiment. I’m going to have my corateed ultrasounded again to see if my um IMT as it’s as as you know as a as a trained physician. Um and that’s also another thing. Make sure that you’re you’re not going to die from something stupid like a stroke or a heart attack if you don’t need to. So you can get a CT scan which is radiation which we know in my lab accelerates aging. So I prefer to if I can help it avoid radiation but ultrasound is very safe and you can do it in 20 minutes on your neck. Yeah, >> you guys do you guys do it? >> We we do. And uh those of you on the

[00:29:02] longevity trip every year we give you a karateed uh scan. Yeah. >> Yeah. Good. >> Um uh in terms of food, uh you’ve gone vegan >> mostly. >> Well, mostly I I struggle cuz there’s a lot of good food out there. I’m a sucker for Japanese sushi, but um but it it’s Serena who inspired me. I I always need to credit her with a big change in my life. Uh she taught me a lot and last night at a gathering we had for the friends of Sinclair lab I I freely admitted that what what turned me on with Serena was her talk about Nvidita Clax and Datib as a senolytic. So I was like wow this woman’s amazing. Uh keep talking chemicals it’s turning me on. >> How do you feel about alcohol? >> Uh I’ve I’ve changed. Um, again, Serena’s inspiration, um, before the data came in, which is now damning for alcohol, even one glass of alcohol a day, uh, correlates with a smaller

[00:30:00] brain. Um, I stopped drinking alcohol a few months after I Serena. You too? >> No. No. I’ve Yeah, I’ve been much much to the chagrin of someone who is my spouse who’s a Somalia. Um, >> Wow. >> Yeah. Yeah, it it it’s unfortunate, but we got to be driven by the science, not by what what we want. But I would say a few times a year, it doesn’t hurt to celebrate with a bit of alcohol. But daily is what what I was doing. Serena said, “What are you doing? You’re eating cheese and red wine every night.” And I said, “It’s the Mediterranean diet. What are you worried about?” So, she said, “No, stop it. Eat this and see what happens.” And within a month, my biomarkers were inflammation went way down, so I’ve stuck with it. >> Yeah. Um, and there I think the the benefit for alcohol is the the social lubricant in terms of having you relax and enjoy. I think one of the biggest challenges I have, David, and I think perhaps for you is the pace of travel and work and stress. It’s a counterveilling force.

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It is. And again, Serena changed my life because I I I’m very hard on myself. If I’m not number one at something, I I’m I’m not I’m not happy. Um, and so I uh I’ve I lived most of my life until I met Serena on edge, ruminating, stressing that I wasn’t good enough. It was it was it was really a bad thing. Um, and then uh she came along and she said just try to breathe, chill. >> She taught me meditation, which I’m still trying to work on, but I have learned not to worry so much. Um, and it it’s hard to do if you’re, you know, an A type like probably most of us in the room. Um, but it it’s changed my life as well. I’m sleeping better. I I think I look better. I feel better because if you’re always tense, uh, it’s going to accelerate your your aging that that’s proven. And the other thing that really helps, which is uh, worth knowing, is it your blood pressure and your cholesterol

[00:32:01] and your blood sugar, these are good ways to live longer. Get a pet, get a partner. Um, but just make sure that you’re socially surrounded by people who love you and you are not lonely because loneliness will kill you. >> More hugs in your More hugs in your life. Yeah, let’s hear it for that.