throw away most of the advice that your parents and your society sort of give you cuz it’s such a dynamic world right now and conforming is the worst thing that you could do. >> I’m John is founder and CEO of Replet which was a YC 2018 company. >> I am not a programmer. I am not a coder but I can now create software. >> I came to Silicon Valley to start the company and that was Replet. >> We knew for a fact that there are a lot of people a lot of ideas and there’s so many barriers in their way. the barrier of programming and the power how hard it is to to write software. >> We’re very quickly going to get through all of the code out the legacy garbage part of society. >> The idea is to be able to talk ideas into creation. Programs are no longer static. You can buy a machine with zero software in it and you can vibe code all of it by just like talking to the machine. The career of the future is entrepreneur. That’s the only career that I think is going to survive. >> If you have access to computers and the internet, you should be able to build something great. And we’re going to find talents all over the world. Those who are having the most impact will rise to the top. What a profound opportunity for
[00:01:00] everybody in the world to make a massive difference. >> Now that’s a moonshot. Ladies and gentlemen, >> welcome everybody. Um, allow me one second to just uh bring on to the stage my two moonshot mates, Dave Blondon. Dave is the creator CEO of Link Ventures. Link Exponential Ventures runs a little over a billion dollars out of MIT. No comment to Stanford here uh on investing in companies in AI space. Uh an amazing guy built one of the very first if not the very first neural net machine learning company exited for a billion dollars and it’s been uphill since then. Uh he and I and Mike Sailor were roommates together at our fraternity. So it was it was quite a corner of the house. >> Um Sele is over here, another moonshot mate, is uh the creator of Exponential
[00:02:02] Organizations. Uh he was my effectively my co-founder along with Ray Kerszswall at Singularity University and uh has been the author of a number of extraordinary books and we’ll learn more about him. I’m John A pleasure. No one needs a introduction of you. The CEO founder of Replet. A pleasure to have you here. >> Nice to meet you. It’s such a pleasure for me. >> Uh if I were to summarize your life, I would go coding an internet cafe in Jordan, rejected three times by YC, finally gets in, builds replet, and is now helping a billion people code. >> Is that a >> That’s right. That’s a good good summary. Yeah. >> Not bad. Now, one of the things that that Dave Seem and I talk about a lot because it’s what we care about deeply is helping entrepreneurs take moonshots >> and having a moonshot that’s part of a
[00:03:01] massive transformative purpose. And and we talk about the idea that an individual today can possibly impact the lives of a billion people. Mhm. >> And what an extraordinary world to be in. >> And I love the fact that your moonshot and sounds like your massive transformative purpose has been to enable a billion people to code. >> When did you first have that vision? >> You know, I I built my So I I used to go code in internet cafes back back in Jordan. Um and uh one thing I realized that they you know they had computers all over the place but they were not using software to manage the system. So everything was you know paper and pen and I decided to build software to manage the the store and that was my first uh company. And the thing that I noticed is that the idea was so powerful and I felt like I could build it very quickly and it took me two or three years to to get the software done. And it took me another, you know, months up to a year to figure out how to actually
[00:04:01] deploy the thing, how to like burn it in CDs, how to get it to the cafe, how to install it there, how to manage the thing. >> And I felt there’s so much there’s such a big barrier between having an entrepreneurial idea and actually deploying it into the world. That’s when I started thinking about, okay, how do you make that process easier? And >> can I can I show you can I show you easy? Can we get the slide up on the screen here? So, this is me this morning. I am I am flying from Santa Monica airport. I’ve got the laptop open in my my lap obviously. You can see a Starlink antenna on the dashboard over there and I’m coding on Replet on the way up here. This this is the future. Yeah, that’s awesome. >> You know, I I tweet this out. Hopefully, you know, >> did air did air traffic control know about this. >> That’s a one hopefully Elon reaches out and talks about the Starlink replet partnership. I think that would be perfect. Um, but I said life doesn’t get
[00:05:01] any better than this. The ability to create on demand anywhere at any time. >> Yeah. Yeah. And and and so in in college, I ran into another problem, which is every time I went to go do a little bit of programming in a different language, I would have to install the development environment again and again and again. And I was like, you know, we we’re moving everything to the web, everything to the internet except programming. And so I started working on what would become the first browser-based coding sandbox. Uh, and that that went viral on Hacker News and and and GitHub and uh and and I remember one of the sort of very important moments was Brendan Ike, the inventor of JavaScript, part of the the kind of Brazil browser, tweeting about my project. So, here we are like I’m at, you know, 20-year-old kid in Jordan in in my parents’ basement uh and the inventor of JavaScript, the language that I use, is talking about my my
[00:06:02] application. And that that was that was huge for me. And um and then I started getting these job offers. Peter Norvik actually was just started to to to create Udacity and he reached out to me and it’s like hey we’re trying to integrate this program you built so we can teach people programming in the cloud and then another company called Code Academy started up on the technology that I built and Code Academy became the the number one coding school in the world. How many people here learn how to code on Code Academy? A lot. I thought it didn’t work but uh but uh you know we we taught 15 million people how to code um and then afterwards I sort of uh left the company and sat back and and you know just reflecting on my own journey you know if if a kid from Jordan is able to kind of come to the US and invent something that affects millions of lives there’s probably millions of other kids like that all around the world >> there are and so that that became my
[00:07:00] mission is like How do you make it so that anyone can build something that could impact millions of people? >> Love it. Dave, >> sir, where’s yours? >> So, uh, really, really, uh, interesting. The the journey from Jordan to Silicon Valley, I think, is worth spending one second on because I have a follow-up question on that. But, but you you you skipped over that in your storyline there. How did you end up actually physically here? Because I know you live here now. >> Yeah. Um, so I I got I got an 01 visa. uh to to go to New York and I was founding engineer at code academy >> uh and then left code academy and then I I couldn’t work at the time uh I left I had 60 days to stay in the country >> by the way can can we talk about how important the O1 visa is and and how and how critical you know one of the things I’ve been tweeting and saying we should be like like stapling a green card on top of every degree that comes out of Stanford MIT or Harvard to to enable
[00:08:01] those entrepreneurs to stay here and work here and contribute to the US economy. >> And I think this part of the story is really important with you in particular because you didn’t come over to go to Stanford or to go to one of the universities here. You already had finished universities in Jordan. >> Yes. >> And so it’s a different story from us. Go ahead. >> Yeah. Um a lot of my colleagues, a lot of other people from from my country typically their way into the US is via university. >> Yeah. >> But I actually wasn’t like a great student because I spent all my time hacking and programming. So my grades were kind of crappy. So uh I had to like I came through the open source route. >> I heard the story of you hacking your university. >> Yes. >> To to change to change your grades. >> Yeah. So I I felt like it was unfair that >> better test anyway, isn’t it? I mean that’s that should be the actual grade. >> Yeah. Like so I I I I was actually getting failed for attendance because I wasn’t showing up. >> Cuz you were doing work. Cuz I was doing work. Actually, one thing I try to do, I had like a Nokia Symbian phone and I was like, can I code on the desk so I can do
[00:09:01] something more interesting than listening to this teacher blabbering? >> I love the fact that you hacked the Y Combinator application and put a Rick Rrow video in the application. >> That’s that’s true degeneracy, >> right? Yeah, that’s right. I mean I mean there’s this I think this this feeling of you know these structures these systems that we built around civilization that is really meant to make people conform. >> Yes. >> Uh >> put you in the box. >> Yeah. Put you in the box. And I I always felt like the first time it worked where I thought differently and did something different and and that allowed me to go through the back door which I think is a more meritocratic way of doing it. I just embraced that and and partly like it it kind of always works out. I don’t know if I’m just lucky but even quitting code academy and nothing didn’t know what to do. I just like got bored and wanted to do something else. I had only 60 days to to stay in the US and I went and applied to a bunch of companies. One thing one company I was really excited about at the time Mark Zuckerberg was
[00:10:01] talking about the vision of internet.org right the idea that you know we’re going to connect everyone in the world. Everyone will have access to the internet. That’s an extension of my mission of if you have access to computers and the internet, you should be able to build something great and we’re going to find talents all over the world. So I I applied to to work at Facebook and the lawyers told me, “Well, you have to go back to Jordan so we can apply for for a new visa.” I was like, “Screw you. I’m I’m not going to do that.” And on my birthday, I got a green card in the mail because I had applied for one and >> something worked. Something worked. And it’s so the idea of like just taking a chance and and kind of the universe rewards you for that. Don’t be too stupid about it. But I think >> that is kind of a it is kind of a scary story though because that’s that green card could have gone any direction. That’s totally random. >> Yeah. And yet here you are and here’s replet. I mean think about what a difference that makes for the world. >> And when I joined Facebook I was sort of like a nobody but like I was really excited about this idea of internet.org and I started working on on Android
[00:11:00] because I thought that Android is the main device that most people are going to be connected to the internet via. >> Yeah. >> And I ran into this problem with Java. job of being this really, you know, you know, crap, no offense to any really crappy programming language, uh, resource hog, really hard to program. And then I happened on a new idea which is okay can we make the mobile platform more programmable started working on that uh and found other people at the company working on it that became react native and react native made it so that any uh you can you know write code once and you can run it in all the different devices and now that that also touched billions of peoples because there’s you know part of Facebook is written in it discord is written in it um and so I I think that just like this idea of um not overplanning your life just going about life and finding interesting problems to solve and solving them usually will net out the right thing >> well so that experience that life experience is a perfect segue into my question which is you know using replet
[00:12:00] to discover talent all over the world so there’s you know two things I’m dying to ask you one of them is the there are two meta questions I can use my own product to discover talent and to recruit and I can use my own product to build my own products we’ll get to the second one later but >> it’s really unique to products like yours that you can actually see a billion people or whatever coding, >> right? >> And you know, you you being discoverable in Jordan through that vehicle, you can now make that a much more scaled version because there’s talent all over the world. That’s right. >> And it’s, you know, it’s not going to naturally, you know, have a a grade point average, a degree, or whatever. And so, how are you going to find those incredibly talented people? Oh, wait. They’re right here using my product every day. I can see them writing incredible code, building incredible products. our our first employee uh we were it was just my co-founder and I my co-founder is my wife and we were kind of struggling to to hire at the time. We weren’t in in YC yet and YC rejected us three or four times. That’s why they had to get Rick rolled. >> Wait, was it was it three or four? I mean, you’re not you’re not going to forget that.
[00:13:00] >> I actually I actually kind of forgot cuz I would apply I would apply every time. >> Oh, I see. >> And then I would record a video every time. You know, the YC videos like a hostage kind of situation. You’re sitting there. How many How many of you have applied to Y Combinator? Three or four times. >> Every week, my team and I study the top 10 technology meta trends that will transform industries over the decade ahead. I cover trends ranging from humanoid robotics, AGI, and quantum computing to transport, energy, longevity, and more. There’s no fluff, only the most important stuff that matters, that impacts our lives, our companies, and our careers. If you want me to share these meta trends with you, I write a newsletter twice a week, sending it out as a short two-minute read via email. And if you want to discover the most important meta trends 10 years before anyone else, this report’s for you. Readers include founders and CEOs from the world’s most disruptive companies and entrepreneurs building the world’s most disruptive tech. It’s not for you. If you don’t want to be informed about what’s coming, why it matters, and how you can benefit from it. To subscribe for free, go to
[00:14:01] dmmandis.com/metatrends to gain access to the trends 10 years before anyone else. All right, now back to this episode. I love that idea that you have a discovery engine for talent, right? And I think one of the things that’s very important today is that the talent is global, genius is global, and the tools are available and demonetized globally. >> That’s right. >> Um, and how how fast it’s changed. I remember I was talking to Dave earlier that when I was when we were both undergrads at MIT there was a course called 61 611 >> 611 >> and I would literally build my computers with ANDgates, NAND gates and NORgates and would hexodimal code them uh you know for finite state machines and that was coding and that was hard as how far it’s come. >> Yeah, you only need a nandgate by the way. But uh you know we we eventually got to EPROMs but it was uh it was
[00:15:00] extraordinary how far it has come. I want to talk about the future of coding one second. >> So there’s you know I had Immad Mustach on my abundance uh stage two years ago. We’re talking about this and he was saying how coding would be done by AI systems and the front page of all the newspapers in India is Immad Mustach announces coding is dead. Um and you got a bunch of hate mail for that. >> Uh what is coding in the future? >> Yeah. So I think to understand coding in the future we have to understand it in the past. So uh in the early era of computing uh maybe in the 30s and 40s and a little bit into the 50s uh computers were fancy calculators. In order to change the programming of computers you had to literally rewire them. So there was no programs. uh Turing in his 1936 paper uh invented the Turing machine and showed that you can build the universal computer. But it wasn’t until von Newman in 1945 that he
[00:16:01] invented the concept of a stored program machine which is what you have in your pocket today. Every computer is a von Newman architecture. Um and that was a huge leap forward. The idea that you can uh you can program a computer was suddenly, you know, a big thing because computers weren’t programmable. people forget that. And um and then you had another leap which is when Grace Hopper invented the compiler. >> One interesting quote that is is actually you know very much reminiscent of this era. Uh and I’m sure she she got a lot of hate mail for that but she said you know we used to kind of program in in machine code. It’s not really programming. It’s kind of similar to like this rewiring of the machine. um and she wanted people to program in English >> and so sort of the C programming language and the high level programming languages that she invented she called them English and it’s sort of similar to what uh you know Andre Karpathy recently said it’s like English is a hot new programming language it’s not hot or new >> Grace Hopper has actually has actually
[00:17:02] thought about it and she was like the specialists are not going away but we’re going to introduce programming to millions of people >> yes >> because programming is going to be in English. Of course, you know, that vision sort of went away and programming became an industry and you had to, you know, go to Stanford for four years to to be able to do it. Uh but but now we’re at a moment, I think, as big as the invention of the comp compiler, perhaps even bigger and as big as the invention of the store program computer, which is uh programs are no longer static. They’re malleable. You can you can you can buy a machine with zero software in it and you can vibe code all of it by just like talking to the machine, right? And that’s been the vision of computing since the start, which is why I think, you know, vibe coding sort of undersells that that vision. The idea is to be able to talk ideas into creation. But your idea generator that gets compiled in code. That’s right. That’s right. What ultimately matters is thinking clearly
[00:18:02] and being able to break problems down into individual components and then being able to communicate it clearly. >> So, so this is a question I have. I grew up doing C++ and Pascal coding etc. Right? and you learn a certain structure navigating data structures, thinking through uh architecting the overall software before you start building it so you’re more efficient and then you go around optimizing etc etc. As people are vibe coding those skills aren’t there. It’s the same thing like a student that’s wring using Chachi PT to write an essay. The thought process of constructing a logical flow of arguments is lost. So do you worry about that or is it the same argument where with that we used to use with assembly line? Yeah, who the hell wants to be writing assembly in machine learning or hexodimal, right? We’ll just do it at the higher level and you’re then articulating those ideas at a higher and higher level. Is that essentially the vector you see going down? >> I I think so. And every time you know someone would make an argument in any
[00:19:00] history of of computing where you say okay this is too high level you’re abstracting the the you know the the NAND gates and the registers and and all of that you’re going to you’re not going to be able to do good work because it’s too high level every time it’s been proven wrong and every time what we thought of is too high level becomes lowle now C programming is lowle for them at the time you know the machine code people was like what what is you know this is [ ] this is [ ] right >> interesting twist on that though if I curse I curse you that you weren’t around when I was doing software development. That’s all I’m going to say. >> Just curse. >> So I didn’t know Grace Hopper invented the the compiler, but if if her original vision was uh you’re going to do it in English, >> but then you look at where Python ended up or you look at where high level languages ended up, >> you can’t really easily specify in English, you know, persistence or pointers or indirection or stuff like that. So it kind of went to some middle ground. So now with Lovable, you can build stuff like Boom. And with Reply, you can build stuff like Boom. And And I’m sure the thing you built on your plane worked, right? >> It did. It was a uh I built a an app
[00:20:03] that would assess my mindset every morning and then would upload it. I would upgrade it based upon sort of give me series of prompts. I I have a book I’m finishing called Mindset Mastery. And I wanted that to become something that it would just be usable for myself. And it was great. It was beautiful. actually was in addition to being great, it was beautiful. Um, I want to hit something that I think is important. So, right now there’s 150 million GitHub accounts. Uh, I looked at I looked at the numbers and if you look at programmer salary over the last 3 years, it’s up 50%. On average and at the same time that we’ve seen 50 uh I’m sorry, the number of programmers, I’m sorry, has gone up 50% over the last three years. At the same time the number of programmers have gone up 50%. Uh the average increase in programming salary has gone up 24%. Right? Which is counterintuitive if there’s an over you know you think it’s an over supply which tells me that the
[00:21:02] value of programmers is massive and it’s you know the exponent is greater than one on this. What happens when we have a billion programmers >> two billion programmers? What’s your vision for that world of abundance? Right. I you know you read abundance early on. Thank you for your kind words. You said earlier uh it is one of the mechanisms for unleashing creativity and increasing you know unleashing entrepreneurship. And we talk about all the time that the the career of the future is entrepreneur. That’s the only career that I think is going to survive. I don’t know if you agree with that or not. >> Yep. >> Um so what is it like when we have a billion two billion programmers coders in the world? >> Yeah. I I think that the world will trend into a more meritocratic society and not not because like there’s someone who has like a an ethical vision of the future and they’re going to impose meritocracy. I think meritocracy will impose itself because those tools
[00:22:00] becoming more available to more people. The those who are having the most impact will rise to the top naturally, right? And I think in every aspect of society. I mean, we talked about our YC story. When we entered YC, it was ultimately because Sam Alman and and Paul Graham saw Replet on on Hacker News. >> So, just to tell the story a little bit, which I’ve heard, you know, you get rejected three times. uh Paul Graham and and Sam basically reach out to you. They they’ve seen you on Hacker News and they’re like, “Okay, you got to apply again.” >> Yeah. So, what happened was uh I wake up one morning in uh late 2017. We had started the company in 2016. It’s been a project for a lot longer than that. >> Overnight success after 9 years of hard work. >> Um and we and you know, we’ve been grinding. It was like two or three of us. We we were like selling to to schools and whoever who can buy our software. >> Mom, would you buy this?
[00:23:01] >> Anyone really kind of door-to-d dooror uh you know programming environment salesman. Um and so I I get this Twitter DM and it’s uh Sam Alman with his lowercase and hey I run YC like dude I know who you are. Um we’re interested in what you’re doing. Would love to meet. Uh and then he gives me this address. I’m like that’s not YC’s address in Mountain View. And so I show up there and it is Neurolink and and um and OpenAI and I didn’t know about either. I maybe I’ve heard about OpenAI a little bit. So I go into OpenAI and Sam was sitting there um and and he says we’re really interested in what you’re doing and um by the way Paul found you in Hacker News because at the time I was like building the system and like blogging about it wrote some interesting blog post and he says well you should go see Paul Graham. Unfortunately he’s retired. He’s not in the Bay Area. You should go to London and meet him. I was like okay let me grab my private jet and
[00:24:00] go. Uh the thing about you know rich people in Silicon Valley once they’re rich they think everyone else is rich like that. I don’t I couldn’t even get a visa to go there you know. So so I’m like how about you give me his email first and we’ll go from there. So I start this email relationship with Paul. Over two months we’re writing back and forth. >> Paul’s a great writer. >> He’s a great writer. I at some point I’ll get his permission to publish the writings that we had. It’s like he would write me essays about uh our shared vision for how programming should be. It’s like the reason we started YC is because we knew for a fact that there are a lot of people a lot of ideas and there’s so many uh you know there’s so many barriers in the way not only the barrier of capital and the barrier of you know getting attention marketing and all that but even before that the barrier of programming and the barrier how hard it is to to write software >> and so we go through all that and at the end uh he’s like yeah I think YC is starting in next week I’m going on a trip but you should talk to Sam about going into YC. was like, “Okay.” And so
[00:25:01] I email Sam and he’s like, “Yeah, yeah, I would love to have you in, you know, you should join.” I was and we have the kickoff tomorrow. And uh I say, “Okay.” And then he shoots me another email. It’s like formality. You should still apply. It’s like, “Ah, [ ] I’m not going to go through the YC application all over again.” >> And how long is the YC application? >> I mean, if you want to do a good job at it, it’ll take you an hour. Uh I’m very lazy. Uh I was like it’s a you know so uh >> you couldn’t have repleted for you, huh? >> No, at the time I couldn’t. There was no LMS and so I had to do it manually, but I I did a very lousy job at it because I just didn’t like hey guys you’re recruiting us. I’m just not going to put in the effort. Um and and so then the video came like [ ] I’m not going to I’m not going to record the video. So I I paste in a link and then I uh we go to the next day. The next day is the kickoff. They do the late interviews. So the the they always have this tradition of like letting a few startup in at the
[00:26:00] at the same day. And so we said the whole day we’re waiting and then finally the door opened and they told us you can come in. And so we go in and I it was like Gustaf Adora and then Michael CEO of uh Y Combator at the time and he was a big guy, right? And I’m shaking their hands and I felt Michael kind of squeeze my hand a little bit. I don’t know what was going on there. So the the moment I sit down on the chair, his face is red. He’s like, “Why did you Rick roll us?” And turns out as we were sitting outside, they were getting Rickrolled inside before the waiting bus. So they clicked on the video and they got this this Rick Roll video place. If you guys haven’t seen it, just go Google it. >> Yeah, there’s a meme. You can find it easily. >> And I um and he was very uh upset and he started really kind of giving us a really hard hard interview. Really good question. But >> And what are what are you thinking at this point? I think we were screwed. Like we’re done. And so I actually exit the room and order an Uber. Uh and my co-founder was like, “We have to wait.” I was like, “Ah, we’re not we’re not
[00:27:00] getting after we did that. We’re not getting in.” But then I get a phone call from Adora Chang and she’s like, “You got in.” And and so so we we we go in that same day and Sam Alman did the did the kickoff and and all of that. >> How was how important was the YC experience uh to you? I mean, would you have accelerated and gotten to this point without it? >> I think I I I think one property that I have is I would never quit and so I would I would have kept going and I think we would have probably made it but it probably accelerated our progress by probably years. I mean it opened a lot of doors uh and just just being around these amazing people being around Sam and Paul and you just raise your ambition a lot being around all the ambitious people >> Silicon Valley thing in general >> and I think that’s what matters the question about talent is is very important there’s talent everywhere but I think the density of the network at places like Stanford it’s like >> Paul Graham have that great quote that being a startup founder is only about 1 millimeter away from being unemployed so
[00:28:00] when you’re telling your parents what you need like-minded people all around you as your support network otherwise it’s just really I mean doing it in Jordan would have been really emotionally difficult and you obviously pulled it through just to put a push pin in that story too incredible story but if anyone from Stanford administration is in the room I know Eric Bolson and others are like your application process is in complete fail but the poll process of discovery is a complete win so now when you’re building your own company you see all these people and what they’re doing you don’t need them to apply to come and work for you. You have the data. You can analyze the data and pull. The world is clearly going to move from applications to big databased pull >> to discovery >> to discovery. >> Yeah. And that’s what I’m saying. The world is going to be forced to be more meritocratic. >> Yes. >> And I think the problem with institution like YC, they’ve gotten better and Stanford, they they’re like very much about pedigree. >> Yeah. >> You know where you’re from. And it’s, you know, it’s not I’m not faulting them for it’s a heristic.
[00:29:00] >> Yeah. If if you’re Stanford dropout, you’re like, you know, Stanford did the work for us to choose you and therefore we’re just going to piggy back on that. But in reality, again, talent comes from everywhere. Philip Rosedale, the creator of Second Life. I don’t know if you know him. >> One day, uh, Philip says, “Do you know why there are more startups in San Francisco than any place else? Why the success story is so high?” And he goes, “I want to tell you what I found out.” So he ran a script on top of LinkedIn where he measured the density of technical founders per square kilometer. Yeah. >> And he found that San Francisco had the highest technical density. Right. There was Austin, there was Cambridge, there was, you know, Miami starts to pop out. But the notion is if if you’re taking the risk of starting a company and you fail, instead of going back to your mom or dad’s, you know, bakery to work, your friend down the street has another startup you can go and join.
[00:30:00] >> And so it is a density uh issue. >> Yeah. But but I think, you know, increasingly that that is moving online. I know you’re good friends with with Bology and his idea of network state and and all of that. And you know, I just I was in Jordan last week and I saw a company there that is, you know, uh, ostensibly headquartered in San Francisco. Uh, they they run all their engineering there, but like they come here quite often. They meet with VCs. They’re, you know, they incorporate in Delaware and when they when they go into meetings, they you know, it’s like it’s almost like their headquarter in San Francisco. And so it’s like, you know, San Francisco is going to the cloud in many ways. >> Yeah. Salem. >> So, you know, this evolution of where things are going with the future of software development is pretty profound. But at the business level, I use the analogy of Kickstarter, right? When Kickstarter appeared, for the first time in business history, you could get market validation for a product without building the product, right? That was kind of incredible. uh what you’re doing is essentially providing an environment where people can write software and
[00:31:01] fully finish that software and then and then get market validation and figure out what’s needed at almost zero cost. That’s right. So this is taking out the marginal cost of all of this stuff which is what we talk about a lot with our in abundance with our exponential organizations link ventures etc. As you accelerate that essentially you get to a point where society is just one huge amount of code being written on a non-stop basis. How do you think about the future of society in the context of that? >> Yeah. So, it’s a great question. >> Let’s zoom out here. Huh? >> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So, I think I if you think about entrepreneurship, I don’t just think about it in terms of like quitting your job and starting starting a business. Uh it’s about uh being able to solve problems in the world and taking initiative without your boss telling you to do that. And so, we’re seeing it a lot in the enterprise as well. like we we’ve seen cases where uh you know an a product manager uh at Zillow being able to deliver millions of dollars in bottom line revenue uh for
[00:32:01] the company because although he didn’t he wasn’t an engineer he was able to increase conversion of you know home buyers at the company and then suddenly everyone heard about the heard about that story now we have 500 licenses at at Zillow and everyone is recommended to Vibe Code because they and more entrepreneurial people that that person got agency >> agency. It’s how you >> and it’s it’s the biggest challenge that large corporations have today is they’re so structured um and they’re so fragile in that structure. I mean See, you talk about this all the time, right? It’s enabling your employees. >> You try anything disruptive in a big company and the immune system attacks you, right? >> Standard problem. >> But but here’s why why voding is important is because you can do it anyways and you can show the results and the results will speak for themselves, right? This is a huge breakthrough. >> Permissionless innovation can happen inside the organization as well. >> So we we call this PDI, permissionless disruptive innovation because in the past whenever you want to do something
[00:33:00] really disrupted, you you had to get the permission from the Medici family or from the church or from the corporation or from the government or from an investor. Somebody had to bless you to do this. Right? Today for the first time in human history, you can do very disruptive things without any permission. Uh my favorite poster child here is is um a Vitalic Bhutan. 18-year-old kid gets together with a few friends. They ignore their professors and now boom, you have Ethereum. A $600 billion ecosystem that nobody understands. >> And so that’s kind of incredible that you can do that and what a profound opportunity for everybody in the world to make a massive difference. >> Yeah. >> And what you’re doing is now providing the scripting language. >> Yes. to take anybody’s massive purpose as we call it and start making it an actual reality. >> So, so here’s where it gets even weirder and stranger and more abundant is that it is not going to be just you doing the disruption. It’s going to be your agents. >> You’ll be able to program agents that are running in the organization finding the inefficiencies and actually making
[00:34:02] progress on your behalf. as well. You can also run a startup that is producing these agents that let’s say you’re someone who’s worked in HR for 30 years. You know all the HR processes. You have a gold mine in your head. You have an unmonetized gold mine in your head. And what you do in the near future, we’re actually launching this tomorrow. Agent uh 3 uh heard it here first, but agent 3 will allow you to create other agents. So, you’ll be able to create like an HR agent. How long you been working on that? >> Uh it’s been it’s been you know about 6 months since uh since agent 2. So I think every 6 months you know it commensurate with the progress in LMS. We’re trying to predict what is the next set of capabilities that would unlock the next version. So we already know what agent 4 is going to look like. They you know we we take a bat we try to build it and over time you know the first version of it would be crappy but then the foundation models and everyone sort of catches up. Yeah.
[00:35:01] >> So, I always tell entrepreneurs, build crappy products. >> So, agents can basically spin off their own agents. >> And there’s going to be an agent. >> What could possibly go wrong? >> Look, I don’t look, I don’t I don’t focus on what goes wrong, other people’s problems. But, uh, >> but but but but you know, it just it’s it’s going to be mindboggling. It’s it’s almost like a singularity moment what’s going to happen once we have agents that can also transact with each other, right? Like so I can have an agent >> which bring which brings in crypto >> which has a crypto wallet that can go hire other agents. >> Sure. >> I I’m my agent is I’m going to raise my agent to be a trillionaire. >> Exactly. >> Yeah. We’re probably going to be seeing autonomous agents with their own wallets and net worth and all of that. >> You know, one thing I heard you speak about is the future of the company. >> Mhm. uh I want to talk about that because we have a lot of entrepreneurs in the audience and on you know the people who who will listen to this uh around the world. I mean most
[00:36:02] corporations today have been built in a very siloed very I think you use the term a factory production mechanism >> um and it’s you know sem you’ve railed against this over John Hegel talks about this all big corporations are designed for two things they’re designed for predictability and for efficiency >> right but in today’s world it’s so volatile you need to be architected for flexibility agility adapt adaptability, speed. That’s right. Therefore, I actually did a talk with you on stage, Peter, a few years ago in Toronto, and the talk title of the talk was the death of the corporation. >> We’re seeing corporations go for to platforms, and platforms go to ecosystems. >> Yeah. Right. >> There’s an economist, I think his name is Thomas Co, and he he has this uh theory. >> Ronald Co. >> Ronald Co. Yeah. The theory of the firm, right? >> Yeah. So we so Ronald Coast wrote a nine-page paper in the 1930s citing that the reason we have bigger and bigger
[00:37:01] companies that a transaction costs inside a big company are cheaper than outside a big company. He won the Nobel Prize in economics for that nine-page paper. We in the book that Peter and I just wrote the second edition of exponential organizations uh we actually declare Kos’s law dead because the transaction costs inside a big company are way higher than doing it on the outside. >> Exactly. Exactly. And therefore the the big companies as a category will start to decline very rapidly. >> That’s right. So so like my takeaway from from that paper is that >> full-time employment is a bug of the system not a >> Yeah. >> In in in reality if >> and doing what you’re doing what you’re told is a bug. >> Doing what you’re told is a bug as well. >> I mean honestly employment is a bug. >> Tell my kids just go out. >> Yeah. Uh so uh the reason why firms have to hire uh people, train them and then put them in this somewhat of a draconian hierarchy is because of the transaction cost of going out of the market tend to
[00:38:00] be cost prohibitive. If you lower that, you know, for example, Uber lowering the transaction cost from like looking for a taxi like that to like a couple clicks of button. If an agent can go hire human or can go hire another agent, then we’re going to see companies shrink and we’re going to see a lot more entrepreneurship and the market is going to be more dynamic. I think more people will get rich and I think there’s going to be just a fast um uh you know, a fast life and death cycle of companies. Dave, do you want to jump into your question from earlier about uh replet coding replet? >> You want the easy one or the hard one first? >> Yeah, give the hard one. Question. >> All right. I’d love to get your insight actually on on this very specific topic. Um, you know, we’re very quickly going to get through all of the code out the legacy garbage part of society, right? Right. Right now you can use Replet to build things so quickly and there’s all this garbage software that was you know it was cost prohibitive to hire enough engineers to do it right now you can just do it. But if we get to the point
[00:39:01] where you can create a thousand times more code 10,000 times more code then it’s all going to be green field. What’s the net new thing we can build >> that adds value that we just couldn’t afford to build before. You have a lot more vision into that than anyone else cuz you can see all these, you know, millions and millions of users and what they’re starting to build. Mhm. >> So what are you seeing them build today that gives you insight into what they’ll be building in the green field future we’re coming into? I think agents and and and the reason we built this what we’re calling the agent stack of agent 3 is um that’s the the sort of the the next evolution of software when you when you look at most pieces of software especially inside the enterprise they’re trying to solve a problem a very specific problem and usually you create a piece of software and then someone will use that piece of software to solve that problem that intermediate step is not needed you create an agent uh programmed and imbued with the domain knowledge to be able to solve that problem and then you run that agent in an autonomous fashion inside the organization and that’s what we’re seeing our users
[00:40:01] struggle with. It’s like, hey, like I want to build this automation process, but it keeps generating an app. Uh, and yes, maybe I need an interface for the chat app to talk to the agent, but I want to be able to uh run it based on hooks, based on time triggers, based on so we’re we’re building all of that. And that’s how our road map works. It’s like we’re seeing what people are trying to do. They’re they’re looking at AI, they’re looking at age, they’re seeing that LM can make good judgments. And I think that’s the main thing that happened in the past 6 months to a year is LMS with agents they can do this multi-step reasoning especially with now GP5 which the scale on the thinking of GT5 like GP5 base is so dumb but GP5 high is so so intelligent so so we’re able to scale that intelligence and um and so right now you these agents can be nodes in in in very nuanced decisionm uh so we had we had some conversation on the stage earlier today about some fairly sketchy research out of MIT
[00:41:02] that indicated that look you know in the real world corporate environment people are getting virtually no benefit out of AI generated coding >> and you’re actually living it do do you have any estimate on how much of of replet is built by replet or what the force multiplier is inside your own organization >> the impact of replet on our organization is more in how we run the company and in even outside of engineering than it is inside of engineering counter intuitively. So >> So you’re using Replet to run Replet. >> Yes, we’re using Replet to run replet. So you know our our sales people for example will um will write some software using Replet that use an LM that analyzes all their call transcripts to find the main reason why people might not buy Replet. They will take that they will go to the product team. They’re like this is the main thing you know we’re missing you know this compliance thing. I really want to touch on this topic because you know you’re probably the oldest guy in your Y cominator cohort, right? >> Yeah. Yeah. >> Yeah. And so when you when you look
[00:42:00] across all these people who are vibe coding or building tools, they have virtually no large scale management experience >> and they’re like, “Yeah, this helped me writing code write code more efficiently.” But it’s actually even better at managing large organizations. You know, all the planning, all of the, you know, like who did what uh and they have no experience with it. I’ve got like about a $2 to $3 million a week payroll and it’s a gold mine in knowing what’s going on across a thousand people that are all >> the embedded data in that payroll is a gold mine. >> It’s a gold mine and and it’s so much easier than the harder challenge of just Sweetbench, >> you know, and and you’re probably the only guy in that YC comator world >> that’s actually running and has run a large organization and sees its advantage as a management tool, not just as a you know, a leaf node code development tool. Yeah, it’s almost like the uh engineers using AI is stable stakes and I would certainly challenge a lot of those I think you call it dubious which I I agree a lot of those studies that are coming out but it’s stable stakes and there’s so many products you can pick out of I think where replet is really shining today in the enterprise
[00:43:01] because of the vertical integration that we do and because you don’t need prior coding knowledge to uh to do all that and by the way we’re launching all these integrations and all the ways in which it can hook into your data infrastructure >> because all of that it’ll help you run the company your legal team. I mean the gentleman here we were talking earlier about his finance team at Dolby using Replet to to kind of run the finance team and I think that’s really profound and not a lot of people are talking about that. >> It’s really you are going to run into some data sovereignty issues and and uh um on premises issues etc. Right? Cuz uh there’s a lot of people that are we we know a medical CEO that got excited by chat and uploaded all their patient data into chap and now they’ve got massive legal issues around that. So you’re going to face some of that. So that’s that’s an engineering solvable problem. Um >> or a lawyer solvable problem. >> A lawyer solvable problem. What I’m excited about is the fact that you know the current stack of business software ERP systems will take certain specific you my co-founder Harish talks about this a lot will take certain use cases
[00:44:01] and automate those. But now you can automate every minutia level use case across a business. All the hundreds of little things that people are doing and anybody can automate those. So the legal team will automate contract drafting and they’ll just start replicating those and getting that out there etc. >> The best thing that happened over the last 10 20 maybe 30 years is the digitization of these organizations and governments and the system of record uh you know systems such as the ERPs the HR systems the CRM Salesforce whatever that is the infrastructure for which the next set of automation and the invention of the of the future work. So we’re exactly at the right time to be able to build these systems. >> All right. You want the hard question? >> Yeah. Let’s let’s go. I want to talk about the vibe coding wars. >> All right. Let’s go. Or I will. >> All right. We’ll start. There’s there’s the the easier and the harder of the two. Okay. The easier one first. All right. Lovable versus replet. >> Uh okay. Good. Good answer. >> Good answer.
[00:45:00] >> Uh all right. First of all, if I look three years in the future, is it all boats rising with the tide or is one of you going to kill the other? Are you going to differentiate and become different? Do you think about it every day? Do you not focus on competition? How’s it gonna >> I think it’s already quite differentiated. I think that the reason people kind of conflate all these products is because you can put in a prompt and get something out. Most of these uh mo most of our, you know, uh competitors uh generate a front-end app. Uh for you like connect them to a database, you need to go grab a database somewhere else. For you to deploy them, you need to find go to AWS and deploy them. The replication actually provisions a database for you. It runs migrations. of the database for you, provisions a production database for you, does that separation for you that helps you with the deploy process. So, so the the platform and the reason we’ve been around for 10 years, we’ve been building the depth of the platform cuz we knew uh that the challenge of programming and making software is not just about the code. It’s about a lot of it’s about the infrastructure. >> I’m think the chart I’m looking at here
[00:46:00] is there’s full stack um and front end only. Right. >> Right. And you’re at the full stack side and then there’s non-technical and technical and you sit sweetly in the middle. >> That’s right. >> But what about Versel then? Because Versell’s kind of Yeah, I think of them as being deploy historically and now suddenly they’re >> Well, in this chart, Verscell’s down here in the bottom right. >> Versel I think with Vzero started as a design tool. >> Yeah. >> Uh and now I I think everyone is seeing that the value is where Replet is cuz Rep is winning all the deals. >> So everyone’s trying to go >> coming after you. trying to come after us, but good luck. >> Okay. Well, that that is a perfect segue into the really hard question. So, we were over at OpenAI headquarters a few weeks ago uh with Kevin Wheel and you know when they launched GPT5, they brought Michael Truit on stage, made a big deal out of cursor, but just a couple weeks prior they were trying to buy Winderf. I was like, okay, wait a minute. I was like, you were friends today in an alternate world where Microsoft didn’t torpedo that deal. You guys would be the worst arch enemies in the world today. So, you know, you got
[00:47:01] these foundation model companies. Are they going to come in your direction or how’s that going to play out? >> The the the the really interesting thing about our market uh is it’s it’s uh total war. They’re they’re no friends. Uh really there isn’t like you know, arguably in, you know, prior eras uh of of of Silicon Valley and tech, they’re like natural allies >> that could form. right now today you’re an ally with someone else they’re going to come out and attack you tomorrow so like you you know you have to be super paranoid if you’re starting a company in this uh in this stage >> are you super paranoid >> of course like you know I think competitions are going to come from everywhere like you know Google is one of our closest partners who spends hundreds of millions of dollars with them and they have three competing products I still love them for it and Sundar still uses replet instead of the other ones but you know it’s shout out to Sundar >> yeah I think of this as the Dropbox box thing where you have one drive, you have iCloud, you have Google drive and but
[00:48:01] just by focusing on that one product area wholeheartedly Dropbox does very well and and I think that will be the same no matter what other people do their interests are so varied >> a rising tide of near infinite demand. >> Yeah, there’s that but also I remember when we were I was at Yahoo you’re you’re managing across a large >> You were aware >> I was at Yahoo by the way too for seven months. >> Yes. I’m and I are going to come over there for you. Anyway, you’re managing in a big company across 120 different web properties and you have to allocate resources etc etc. One dedicated team is always going to beat you, >> right? >> Always over that. By the way, if you said if you said, “Yeah, we want to be just like Dropbox.” >> Yeah, Dropbox is is a great company. But I think that um I think that it’s it’s a lot more brutal than than those errors because >> well you know back say a decade or two ago you had this politeness between the big companies right you Google would say uh Microsoft would say to Google don’t
[00:49:01] come into the office space and don’t improve Google docs too much we won’t come after search too much this polite thing now all the all the gloves the gloves are off now the gloves are off well because everything’s converging on AI you know they they all settled into their swim lanes. They said, “Okay, Apple, your phones are fine and you know, Bing will suck forever. We’ll just commit to that.” But then, you know, um, sorry, >> but anyway, it was all day tant and now all of a sudden it’s all out war because everything is converging on, oh wow, all that matters is AI. >> So, so 100% agree with uh, Salem on the idea that the customer segment focus is is a superpower and that’s that’s very important. That being said, I I do think there’s a potential that this product will differentiate but eventually converge. So, agent 3, you’re going to see it tomorrow. It’s the most autonomous agent on the market. Uh, and it can we we ran it like 2 days ago for 4 and a half hours because uh we right
[00:50:00] now it can test its own code. >> And you know, you and I were talking earlier about is AGI here? Is AGI not here? The thing that would make me feel like you can define the current era of models as AGI is because if they get real and good environmental feedback, you can run them endlessly and have them actually try to solve a problem and invariably what we’re seeing in software, if you’re able to spend as many tokens as as as you can and you’re they’re running in a good environment, they’re solving these problems. I’ve heard you say that it’s this uh sort of universal expansion of coding capability that you believe is going to lead us to AGI. >> Yeah, I I think I think that’s >> I think I think AGI is here already personally, >> right? >> I think we passed the touring test, didn’t notice. I think we passed AGI. Haven’t noticed. And and we’ll see if we notice. >> I call BS on this. Um we’re talking about something we can’t define, we don’t can’t measure, and we don’t have a test for. >> Yes, that’s why I can. Oh, can we get a
[00:51:00] piece of turning test that had a measurable outcome, right? It was very clear AGI and now we’re talking about ASI and we still have no idea what any of that means. So anyway, aside from that, I’m fine with the conversation. >> I have a question though. Can I >> but just to answer that like the uh the insight from Turing is that the Turing machine, the computer is the ultimate problem solving machine. >> Yes. >> That scales infinitely >> that scales infinitely. And that is the uh that is the millu in which intelligence will use in order to solve any problem. So whatever AGI system you can imagine ultimately it’s going to be writing code to solve problems. That’s my fundamental belief. >> Yes. >> Okay. Interesting. Okay. Can I take this in a slightly different direction? >> Maybe. Um just a show of hands. How many of you at this event over the last couple of days have had your minds completely blown? Just a show of hands. Okay. a bunch of you. All right, I’m going to try and go for one right now. Um, so we have uh biology which is
[00:52:00] essentially software, right? You have 50 trillion cells in the human body each governed by the DNA. Uh, now essentially we can now edit >> 3.2 billion lines of code. >> We can now edit the DNA like you would software. Essentially a human being is now a software engineering problem. Um, when you when you apply replet to biology code, um, are you seeing that happen? When do you see that happen? What do you think of the >> the name replet sounds very biological another? >> Yeah, completely. Is that a coincidence? It’s right there in the name. >> Uh so uh I mean ultimately what like the fascinating thing about LMS which is similar to to the DNA code is how much knowledge it compresses. Uh I downloaded this app called I think full moon on my on my phone that allows you to download open source 1 billion parameter models cuz I was in the plane. I like to read books in the plane. I know there’s starling in the planes right now, but I pretend they don’t exist >> because there’s like 12 hours that I can like read a book in peace.
[00:53:00] >> And so I was like, but I need to look some stuff up. So let me download like Deepseek 1B. And it’s amazing how good it is. I mean, obviously hallucinates and and you need to check its work and everything like that. But 1 billion parameters, what is that like less than 1 GB? >> Yeah. >> And that embeds a large portion large portion of human knowledge. And if you run it for longer like R1 does, DeepSseec R1, it can solve problems as well. And >> can’t wait to download it into my Neurolink chip. >> Yeah, exactly. Like like the these systems are efficient and it shows you that something about the nature of the universe that there’s so much data noise and redundancy that you can really boil things down to like very small uh like sort of uh you can boil things down like the essence of things is actually very simple. Isn’t it mind-blowing to you actually the the data like if you take even a big big big neural net you got about a trillion parameters it fits easily on your laptop and this is all human knowledge everything on Wikipedia
[00:54:01] everything from the internet all learned and you know about 100 to $200 million training process and it all compresses down and it just fits on your laptop now it’s the processing is way too slow so getting it to run on so that’s why you need to run the billion parameter model >> but but putting that aside just the amount of storage that we have >> is is just incredible and the amount of pro and this is why Nvidia is worth so much the processing soci and and just say god we’ve been so inefficient because I think the ultimate LM will probably be about a billion parameters >> that crazy >> and um you know back to to DNA and bio like we’re seeing like openi had a big results obviously alpha fold before that clearly we have the data to train and now with you know the way we train LMS is unsupervised learning so you don’t you can like find this compressible information out of this massive sea of a lot of noise um without supervision without data labeling and I think LMS will get really good at that and once
[00:55:01] they’re able to generate uh be able to like code bio the thing on us would be to create these environments and that’s what what I see company our company as a you know as a tech company we’re about creating environments we’re creating we want to be the best habitat for LM MS right now the best habitat for LMS is to be in a virtual machine environment but but in the future >> one more question to close out the competitive landscape topic. Uh so if I look at the the companies that do coding so you know repletable cursor windsurf um blitzy uh you guys are probably the only one that built foundation models cuz you were there early so you actually trained these things. I think everyone else just picked up you know open AI or whatever later. Um, so then you’re like, “Okay, well, we’re not going to spend $100 million to build training our own model. It’s is way too expensive.” So now we’re on top of the other guys. Oh, wait. Now our valuation >> is in the billions. >> You’re raising tons of money as confidential. I just found out. So
[00:56:00] raising tons of money and you’re not actually planning to consume it, right? You haven’t spent the money from your last funding, but you have a war chest now that actually is plenty big to actually train Foundation models. So is there is there a version of your future where you get back into the foundation model training business? So I think I think it’s it’s cyclical and the way the way it works uh when we went from GPT2 to three there was a there was a period of time where there wasn’t a lot of progress the tricks were known so we sort of knew how to do pre-training the labs was busy cooking up you know mixture of experts and GPT4 whatever there’s a period of time where startups can actually use their data and add a layer on top of these foundation models and fine-tune do all of that and so replet code 3b 3 billion parameter was state-of-the-art coding model in uh 22 23 uh and and and that put us ahead of the competition because no one else had access to a model that cheap and that easy to run. >> Uh but then the foundation models did another big jump you know the scaling up
[00:57:00] of of the models. I I think we’re reaching a point where it makes sense to go back into training >> because we have a certain data set that we think is very helpful especially for the kind of use cases that that that that replet does and we’re starting to find places in our agent architecture because it’s not just one agent we have so many sub agents we have the testing agent we have >> we were able to build a computer use model uh a computer use architecture that is three times uh faster and 15s times cheaper than the state-of-the-art from the from the big labs. >> Wow. >> And I think that we’re going to continue finding these things until we get the next frontier model that actually and that’s what happens is that’s the history of machine learning, the bitter lesson. Then it le it uh then you can pour data in compute and you can consume all these use cases and so just being open-minded about it. Some companies were like, we’re gonna go, we’re gonna die. We’re gonna live or die by training. But for us, we’re ultimately
[00:58:00] trying to, you know, solve a problem and pursue a mission and we’ll just do whatever it needs to get there. >> I really I really thought in a million years that you would never have the guts to say that, you know, I mean, you have the capital to do it and and but I could see there’s there’s actually some MIT alum, brilliant Christian Bailey here and others. their eyes lit up as soon as you said that cuz I think I think that mission statement that you just outlined will attract a ton of talent >> that doesn’t want to go to someplace boring. They want to do something you know super >> I want to close us out going back to your roots. So listening to us uh you know our our moonshots podcast when the three of us discuss uh taking moonshots uh there are entrepreneurs around the world who are a young Amjad someplace in the Middle East someplace in Southeast Asia in South and Central America um who are dreaming big um what’s your advice to them what’s your advice to in inspire them and and how should they
[00:59:00] think about their next few years because do you agree that the next few years are really the game? >> Yes. Yes. Um it’s everything. >> My advice will probably get them into trouble but uh I think that’s that’s part and parcel. Um >> we’ve had the conversation skip university, go build a company. >> Yeah. I mean there is there >> I think all those are are details. I think you know if you get into Stanford get in and then drop out. What really ma what really matters is throw away most of the advice that your parents and your society sort of give you because it’s such a dynamic world right now. >> Don’t do what you’re told. >> Yeah. And and conforming is the worst thing that you could do. >> Don’t do what you’re told. And it’ll take real, you know, self-programming to actually exit that mindset of really doing what you’re told and try to try to really think from first principles about what what you >> find your find your inner purpose. Why? You know, there’s I love the quote from uh from Mark Twain. He says, “Two important days on in your life. The day you were born, the day you found out
[01:00:00] why.” >> Yeah. >> Yeah. And I think uh you know, the meme, the midwood curve, I think has a real truth to it in that you can really over your over plan your life, overthink your life, following your intuition, and you know, being attracted to a problem. I think there’s a you you were talking about the human spirit, right? There’s something, and I agree with you, there’s something essential about the human spirit that probably not going to be captured. >> We’re saying I tweeted last night, the one thing AI will not replicate or displace is the human spirit. >> And I think because we’re humans, we live among other humans, we can see problems that um are very, you know, are very important for our communities and the people around us that are not going to be embedded in the machine. And so following your intuition for what problems you want to solve will probably net out a a a truly unique and differentiated position in the world for you to have. I mean I’m very blessed to have a long-term mission like I’ I’ve
[01:01:01] sort of found my purpose and I think the way to do it is to follow your curiosity and intuition. If it takes you university then that’s fine. If it takes you to building company that’s fine as The implication of this is pretty profound because take education right we’ve been doing education from a supply side perspective for 100 years where you go get a skill you become a developer an accountant a doctor whatever and then you go to the job market to sell those skills all of that evaporates now and now we have to move to the demand side and say what problem do you want to solve that’s right >> and now you get the tools and the technologies the techniques the rep repositories to solve that problem >> and that I think is going to be the most exciting change that we’re going to see >> yeah place to blows out and uh respect the t the clock here. Ladies and gentlemen, I’m Jad Msad. Thank you. David Blondon, Selenus Mal. Oh, >> every week my team and I study the top 10 technology meta trends that will transform industries over the decade ahead. I cover trends ranging from humanoid robotics, AGI, and quantum
[01:02:00] computing to transport, energy, longevity, and more. There’s no fluff. only the most important stuff that matters that impacts our lives, our companies, and our careers. If you want me to share these meta trends with you, I write a newsletter twice a week, sending it out as a short two-minute read via email. And if you want to discover the most important meta trends 10 years before anyone else, this report’s for you. Readers include founders and CEOs from the world’s most disruptive companies and entrepreneurs building the world’s most disruptive tech. It’s not for you if you don’t want to be informed about what’s coming, why it matters, and how you can benefit from it. To subscribe for free, go to dmandis.com/tat trends to gain access to the trends 10 years before anyone else. All right, now back to this episode. [Music]